Limyaael ([info]limyaael) wrote,
@ 2004-04-02 09:32:00
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Current mood: accomplished
Current music:Heather Alexander- A Gypsy's Home
Entry tags:fantasy rants: spring 2004, rants on change, themes i turn to

In service of change
Mainly this applies to long series, or multiple series with the same themes. I've written both, and noticed some of the same problems in each. Some advice to keep the characters changing, in the service of change rather than static formulas.

(Of course, static formulas may be fun depending on the genre. Mysteries and romances often thrive on them. But if it's not obvious by now, I think fantasy can be more than that. Yes, I am biased. Fantasy kicks much ass).



1) Make sure to change your lead character's personality over time. This is one reason I find it hard to read hard-boiled detective series; the detective always seems to have the same baggages, the same methods of doing things, the same lines. They evolve beyond character quirks into strict outlines the character must fit- or rather, they don't evolve at all, which is the problem. The only one of these series I ever managed to enjoy was Raymond Chandler's Philip Marlowe series, probably because of Chandler's language.

This static nature can kill a fantasy series, since very few of them have the structure of repeated adventures that a detective series does (another of Chandler's saving graces). Most fantasies tell an advancing story, about saving the world or completing a quest or fighting a war or building a society- or should. An unchanging main character is a grand way to make it seem as if the story isn't advancing at all.

Give your lead character problems that alter him permanently. Make him suffer. Make him grow (or lose) in magic. Shake his whole world up in one novel and show him dealing with that in the next. Above all, don't let healing processes take him right back to the person he was before. I detest the scene- and it comes in most fantasy novels- where a character wakes from a coma or returns from a mission or comes out of depression, and "smiled the same way he always did." He wouldn't smile the same way he always did. It might not be weaker, if the experience strengthened him, but it should be changed.

I think the need for change is greater, not less, when dealing with immortal characters and long stretches of time in a book or between one book and another. Otherwise, your immortal characters become lifeless caricatures, a la most fantasy elves, and the years mean literally nothing. Only if you're really going for this should you leave immortal characters the same, and that makes it all the harder for readers to relate to them. Most authors don't hesitate to give immortal characters physical advantages. Why strip all emotional complexity from them as a punishment?

2) Keep count of the years. If you have a ten-year-old character at the beginning of the novel, and by the end seven years have passed, the character should be seventeen. I know, this is probably the most obvious thing you ever heard in your life, but it gets ignored in a lot of fantasy series. To an extent the blame can be laid at the feet of series in other genres, such as the endless high school series like Sweet Valley Twins where the characters never age, but a lot of it is people not wanting to alter their characters again. The seventeen-year-old acts as calm and submissive, or as defiant and nasty, as the ten-year-old, with no change at all.

A lot of people do try to make some adjustment for teenagers, but even there, change happens up to a certain point and then stops. The hero who lost his "true love" at sixteen will still be brooding about this ten years later, when he's twenty-six, with no sign that he'll ever stop, unless the author just as mechanically strips him of grief and brings in a new "true love." Time doesn't appear to touch the character's personality at all, never mind his wounds.

A comparison with yourself can be valuable here. Imagine what you were like ten years ago. What did you care about? Now ask yourself how many of those same things you still care about.

Most people lament the passing of favorite cartoons, fads, foods, toys, concerns, and so on with, "Oh, yeah! I remember that!" Why not adapt that to the fantasy world? Why does the hero always recognize the heroine at once when she comes walking up to his door ten years later? Why not have him squint his eyes, stutter around her, and perhaps even have forgotten that incident she was referring to?

3) Incorporate mortality as well as eternity. Often, deaths in fantasy are excused with some tale of an afterlife, or the idea that "Well, they died in the service of a higher purpose, so it's all to the good." This diminishes grief, and, I think, is one of the reasons that fantasy characters can seem to go unmarked (except in the most superficial ways, such as the frozen PTSD-like reaction I mentioned earlier) by death and loss. Mortality is tucked away. Loss dies a death. Characters are deposited in front of elves to watch them sing, say, "Oh, how sad," and then hustled away to a new pretty thing, without ever thinking of the elves again.

I don't usually think much of Tolkien as a characterizer, but he manages to evoke sadness with a master's hand. The Fellowship sees beautiful things (Lothlórien, for example) that are dying, and then the Elves leave Middle-earth, and the appendices of the books conclude with the dying or passage over the sea of the major characters. It's one of the things that makes Middle-earth seem like a complete world, that it can have an end.

Mortality can change your characters. If your sheltered princess, who's never been in any danger before, comes near an assassin's knife, what is she going to think? It should affect her far more profoundly than a little faint and screaming fit, and it shouldn't be completely soothed away by one of the other characters saying he'll protect her.

4) Don't contain change just because the story is self-contained. Don't end a story or series or book with the assumption that the character isn't going to change any more. I roll my eyes when the characters appear to be perfectly in love, when the royal pair is perfect for the throne, when everyone predicts perfect children and no more threats for them. The story ends there, and with it, the characters cease to live. There should be at least doubt for them off the page.

Many authors know the sensation of characters running away from them in the story. The end is your chance to let them run away from you forever. Let the reader wonder what is going to happen. Implant seeds of arguments, perhaps not ones that would tear the couple apart but ones that would happen. Don't try to imagine their family life; after all, especially if they come from abusive or tragic backgrounds, there's no guarantee they'll be perfect parents. Don't make it clear what kind of life is waiting for them. It could be anything. This is much better than one of those stupid epilogues taking place a few years later that makes it clear the characters have no enemies and the most beautiful children and the most wonderful lives imaginable.

It's hard to achieve a balance of this and satisfying your readers, of course, but my favorite authors all manage it. Their characters are people, not models the authors are positioning on their stage for their own amusement.

5) Challenge yourself. This is the best way of avoiding repeating themes. Written two books or two series about saving the world? Do something different next time. Force yourself to write from the perspective of a character who's the complete opposite of your previous main character. Tackle a different fantasy subgenre. Do research in a different direction. If you wrote an all-human society the first time, do this one from within a non-human society.

Sometimes all that's needed is a change of setting. I've completely ignored Terry Brooks's Shannara series for a while, because he seems to repeat the same themes and pattern of saving the world in all of them. (His concentration on a few families doesn't help this). But he wrote an urban fantasy trilogy that I actually enjoyed (Running with the Demon, Knight of the Word, Angel Fire East), because, even though it was also about saving the world, he dealt with a much darker canvas, two main characters in unpredictable patterns, and evil forces not incarnated in mystical objects, the way they tend to be in Shannara.

The comforts of writing a familiar world are, of course, comforts. That can't be overstated. I know that I'm in danger of being trapped in minutiae in the first world I created; I'm no longer in need of establishing huge political and historical structures, so I write stories that delve into things happening around the edges instead. But these end up connecting back to other stories I've already written. I've gotten suspicious of myself there. In new worlds, I'm forced to cope with different races and geography and circumstances, and not rely on what I've already established.

6) Know when to let go. I've lost all respect for authors like Jordan and Goodkind and R. A. Salvatore, Laurell K. Hamilton and Mercedes Lackey. It went first for their writing ability, and now I get impatient with the way they're stretching their series. Either they've lost all control of their casts of characters, or they're milking them for money, or both.

It's probably possible to stretch any story, and even easier with fantasy than with most of them, since they often have a whole new world to play in, large casts of characters to show off, and magical systems to explore. But at some point, you have to leave. Your characters have their own lives to lead (see point 4). If you're writing a biographical fantasy that's with them from birth to death, at some point they still have to die. If you're writing about their children (must you?) those children will pass beyond you, too, especially if you're faithfully paying attention to point 2 and aging them. Family-centered or dynasty-centered fantasies can be fun, but only if the characters have their own personalities and aren't just repeats of their ancestors. Too many of them are. At that point, it's time to wave them on into their own sunrise and go on into your own.

This is a reason that it's a good idea to develop a sense of the length of a series. If you know that a trilogy will contain it best, don't start changing your mind about that just to spend more time with the characters, no matter how much you love them. And don't write another trilogy in continuation if you don't have something truly new to say.

There's a special situation that applies when an author isn't stretching a series for money, love of the world, or love of a family, but because of falling in love with a character. This is yet another reason out of the grand panoply of them to avoid falling in love with your character. Writing book after book about the same character because they're who you love turns comfortable and boring and eventually unreadable. Most series disintegrate in quality as they lengthen. The only exception I can think of is Terry Pratchett's Discworld series, and he pays attention to time and past experiences, doesn't spend every book on the same group of characters, and has changed his writing style from one filled mostly with humor to one filled mostly with satire that cracks down all the harder for being thoughtful and not a joke-a-minute. (And even then, there are people who don't like his newer books).

Know when to say good-bye, unhood the falcon, and let it fly.



It's a shame, really, how many stories are spoiled by the characters always being the same over book after book.




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[info]youraugustine
2004-04-02 08:22 am UTC (link)
1) is probably what's the most fun with my immortal, is tracking the changes (and the reason for them) as he goes from the absolutely jaded, cynical, spoiled brat that he is when I first pick up with him (chronologically) to the person he is at the end.

2) is a pain again. ::g:: I can safely ignore most passage of years with my elves once they hit about a hundred years old, but before that I still have to keep track of individual years and account for them. And humans are just a paaaaaain. < /unserious complaining>

3) Often, deaths in fantasy are excused with some tale of an afterlife, or the idea that "Well, they died in the service of a higher purpose, so it's all to the good." <--I blame backlash against this for having no visible deities in the [info]eagles_phoenix world and for me killing off about half the population and then leaving my people to deal with the full consequences of that at the end.

4) The story ends there, and with it, the characters cease to live. I blame this tendency as well for my own tending to dump the horrors of the end on my people and then only getting them about halfway to recovering and then leaving them. Life comes next. It's their job to figure out how to live it.

5) But these end up connecting back to other stories I've already written. If it's done decently, as a reader, this is actually a joy. It's one of the reasons I love the Discworld books so much. I loved Wee Free Men not just for the plot and the main characters, but also because of the outside-glance it gave us of Granny Weatherwax and Nanny Ogg. I'm a geek for those kinds of things.

6) Yes. The [info]eagles_phoenix world tracks the life of one particular immortal. At the end of the actual story Eagle's Phoenix, that's it. The only thing that's even possible to have left are shorts and the resolution of one particular sidestory (Severe, the story of my twins), which are mostly for the gratification of me and other people like me who are geeks for it. The very last coda and bow to the world is Suite for the Living and Dead (in terms of chronology, obviously, I'm not done writing the rest yet!). There has to be an end. I don't mind shorts after that end (things like Gaiman's Endless Nights, for example), but let it rest.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:33 am UTC (link)
1) I love changing immortal (or near-immortal) characters. Given the length of time they go through, I think it's perfectly plausible to believe they would go through almost all the possible personality changes, assuming they had wars, deaths of close friends, plagues, creation of new magic, and so on to produce those effects.

2) Genealogy is what kills me. I'm always having to realize, "No, I can't have that character born in that year, as that would make his mother about eleven years old."

3) I think it would be perfectly fine to have no deities. Most fantasy worlds have them; why not be different?

4) There are some characters of mine whose deaths I know (because it would make a difference to other stories whether or not they were alive- damn interconnecting world!), but I see no point in writing constantly about only those characters.

5) Pratchett does the connection better than anyone I've ever seen. I also like how he doesn't make characters with no particular reason to love the main characters of other subseries (like William de Worde in The Truth, with the Guards) look at them the same way.

6) I think too many people don't let there be an end because they become consumed with getting one particular story told. And so they focus and focus and focus on that, and ignore all the other ones they might have told with more ease.

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[info]youraugustine
2004-04-03 08:04 am UTC (link)
1) Of course. The other thing that's fun is tracking which parts of them don't change, at least for me. Or which parts don't get so much changed as slightly tilted.

2) Oh yes. That's a pain, too. Or realizing that by giving character X a reasonable amount of time to grow up and acheive end A, you're getting character Y too old to reasonably go out and adventure. Or something.

3) Moreover, I lose a lot of respect for fantasy deities. They're so . . . banal. I tend to see no reason for people to worship them. It seems to boil down to power and ability to create, and so what? My immortal plays with solar flares when he's bored and raised the main elven city out of the ground, and he is most decisively NOT a god. Most fantasty authors lose the sense of awe and the ineffable in making their deities solid and real.

5) [grin] Yes. Pratchett is remarkably adept at creating real people, considering he cloaks his stories in satire. I'll admit that someday, I want him to have Granny Weatherwax meet Sam Vimes. Just to see what would happen.

6) I think you might well be right, but I also think that it's just another temptation to ignore. Because the problem becomes, you see, topping the first story. It's something I can get away with in EP because it's fairly obvious that the ending of Sintai Aresthe is not the END-end; very little is resolved, the main villain is not killed, several of the main characters are simply dumped into a draincellar of Hell, metaphorically speaking, and no one says anything about getting them out. Eagle's Phoenix then finishes the story. But there's no way I could top EP's ending, not without making it look like I'm stretching to top it (Eddings, this is me looking right. at. you.). It's just bad storytelling, and like all bad storytelling, to be avoided.

(getting tired of my endless replies-to-replies yet? ::self-mocking laugh:: )

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[info]jenlittlebottom
2004-04-02 08:41 am UTC (link)
This should be mailed to Eddings and forced down his damnable throat.

That is all.

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[info]marumae
2004-04-02 09:06 am UTC (link)
DEFINATELY. I agree on all points.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:34 am UTC (link)
*grin* I was thinking of Eddings, but he somehow escaped my final flaying of authors I think went downhill by spending too much time on one world.

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[info]lynnbodoni
2004-04-02 09:17 am UTC (link)
Know when to let go. I've lost all respect for authors like Jordan and Goodkind and R. A. Salvatore, Laurell K. Hamilton and Mercedes Lackey. It went first for their writing ability, and now I get impatient with the way they're stretching their series. Either they've lost all control of their casts of characters, or they're milking them for money, or both.

You forgot Anne McCafferty there. She really did some great and exciting things in fantasy at first, then she tried to recast her stories as science fiction, and then she keeps milking Pern. I loved Pern when it was a fantasy series, much less so when she's tried to force it into SF mode. Several books ago, I concluded that she's written everything worthwhile about Pern that she's ever gonna write, and I've quit reading the series. A pity, really. New readers are going to pick up the latest book, read it, and wonder why everyone has raved about her.

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[info]lynnbodoni
2004-04-02 09:20 am UTC (link)
Bah. I MEANT to say McCaffrey.

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[info]transnomad
2004-04-02 06:08 pm UTC (link)
See, I liked it more when she tried to force it into sci-fi. But then, I like sci-fi better than fantasy (because I think fantasy doesn't usually bother to explain things), so that could be a factor. Also, I stopped reading the Pern books a while back because the series was approaching that critical mass where you're just writing more books for the sake of having more books to sell. (Star Wars novels are my prime example of this.)

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[info]lynnbodoni
2004-04-02 10:01 pm UTC (link)
If your fantasy doesn't explain things, then you're probably reading bad fantasy. For instance, in Barbara Hambly's magical fantasies, mages (witches, magicians, whatever) are usually forbidden to marry, because 1) the societies are generally biased against mages and 2) mages will pursue magic at the cost of ALL relationships. Mages will form bonds with other people...but those other people know that the mage is quite likely to leave suddenly for what seems to be no good reason, though the mage, of course, will have a reason.

Of course, if you're talking about explanations of the Dr. Robert L. Forward physics variety, well, then I'd say yes, fantasy usually DOESN'T offer such explanations, and I think I would find it dull to read such a story. I don't find Forward's explanations dull, but I do have to be in a certain frame of mind to read them with enjoyment.

I like both science fiction AND fantasy. I also like mysteries, general fiction, and non-fiction. It's like food. I like corned beef AND ham AND chocolate AND cheese AND artichokes AND...well, just a whole lot of different flavors and textures. I just pick the one I'm in the mood for at the moment.

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[info]transnomad
2004-04-03 09:23 am UTC (link)
I think it's entirely possible that I've been reading bad fantasy; though I'd also say that if the explanations end up being mind-numbingly dull (which they easily can), then you're reading bad science fiction. I realize a lot of people don't share that view, since a lot of the really dull stuff has won awards, but any story that can't make itself interesting is in my book a bad one, and any novel that can't make physics interesting is doing physics a disservice.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:36 am UTC (link)
Hmmm... I think McCaffrey is another of those authors that people probably have to find at the right time in their lives. I still like Dragonsdawn and the Harper Hall Trilogy, but everything else has lost its luster for me (her sexism helped in that). I think it was less the science fiction vs. fantasy aspect, and more that the books started becoming caught up in soap-opera concerns and anti-realism as far as I could see (I still refuse to believe that the dragons could survive being in space to move the Red Star around).

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[info]onyxflame
2006-02-22 05:19 am UTC (link)
Yeurgh, what about Xanth? It was fun for a while, but then I began to wonder when someone replaced the brains of all the characters with mindlessly fucking rabbits. (I guess they ran out of Folger's crystals.)

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[info]tsuki_no_bara
2004-04-02 09:31 am UTC (link)
>>I've lost all respect for authors like Jordan and Goodkind and R. A. Salvatore, Laurell K. Hamilton and Mercedes Lackey. It went first for their writing ability, and now I get impatient with the way they're stretching their series<<

maybe if jordan's books weren't ALL THE SAME.... i mean, i give him props for the world-building, but after seven books i realized nothing had happened, nothing was going to happen, and i'd have to wait at least a year before i could read another thousand pages in which, you guessed it, nothing happens. his editor should be shot.

re #1: i remember in high school one of my english teachers teaching us that when a character hadn't changed at all by the end of a book, it meant he wasn't a character at all but a symbol. that just ticked me off - it was like the teacher was basically giving us a good excuse for crappy characterization. (we were reading either anna karenina which i didn't like because i was annoyed that she had to kill herself in the end, or camus' the plague which i also didn't like because it was taught as an allegory, and i was shallow enough to want to enjoy a book for itself and not for what it was meant to say about the wider world. i don't mind a little political or social commentary in my books, but if that's the whole point of the book i'd rather read something else.)

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:38 am UTC (link)
Jordan's characters are all the same, too. Flat, shrill, shallow stereotypes called women, and men who wonder about how to control the women and end up being herded around by them. Ugh.

I think it's perfectly possible to make a point with your story or even risk it being interpreted as an allegory (look what happens with LOTR, after all) and still have it be a good story. But I think a large part of that isn't deliberate. The author puts in something that sounds good to her, and people find whatever they find in it.

The way I take care of static characters is to say that they probably do change, just off-screen where the main characters, caught up in their own chaotic lives, don't see it.

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[info]troubadour118
2004-04-02 09:55 am UTC (link)
I enjoyed Terry Brooks's Word and Void trilogy as well. They're tons better than Shannara, both in terms of prose quality and originality.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:40 am UTC (link)
I was startled to find how much I liked the third book (the second book did disappoint me, since the identity of the demon was pretty obvious). I think that, because he might already have conceived of this as a trilogy and not a series where he had to keep bringing back characters, it gave him more ability to put the characters in danger.

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[info]bbhtryoink
2004-04-02 10:22 am UTC (link)
I find it hard to read hard-boiled detective series; the detective always seems to have the same baggages, the same methods of doing things, the same lines. They evolve beyond character quirks into strict outlines the character must fit- or rather, they don't evolve at all, which is the problem.

Side note here: I read a how-to-write book by Orson Scott Card (which actually, compared to your rants and to some other books I've read, hasn't been very helpful at all) and he mentions the stagnant detective character. The reason why the detective in most mystery stories is a stagnant character (according to Card) is because, if the detective changes significantly, it's hard to keep going with the series. Once the detective is a different person, his reasons for doing detective work generally evaporate.

I'm not sure how much I agree with that, but I personally offer a different reason: it takes a lot of emphasis off of the mystery plot-line. If, for example, the detective finds that his ex-financee is the primary suspect of a murder crime, and he keeps on getting wound deeper and deeper into his relationship with her, the sub-plot quickly inflates until it might override the main plot. Keeping the detective as just that--a detective--helps focus on the mystery without annoying distractions.

Keep in mind that I personally do not read mysteries, so this is all just speculation from me. =)

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[info]transnomad
2004-04-02 06:28 pm UTC (link)
There are a lot of things I don't agree with Orson Scott Card about (enough that I generally don't like his books anymore), and that's one of them. That kind of logic assumes that detectives aren't actually people, but rather plot devices used to perpetuate the story of the mystery. The flaw in that logic is that detectives are not a fictional creation; there are people in real life who solve mysteries for a living, and it seems silly to assume that those people reman static individuals from the time they get into the profession until they retire.

I'd say the real problem is that mystery novels are formulaic and, from a literary standpoint, really dull. The only thing that makes them interesting is the mystery itself, and since the mystery is the whole point of the story, why bother treating the characters who are only there to solve the mystery as individuals in their own right? (That's a hypothetical question, though my answer would be "because that doesn't make for a lame and formulaic story.")

What I don't see the point of is mystery series where the characters don't change, but the author keeps bringing back the same detectives. If we're supposed to care about these people, do something with them; if not, I'd just as soon see a whole new set of detectives, because that would be far more interesting.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:41 am UTC (link)
I've heard some helpful things and some unhelpful things about Orson Scott Card's writing books. The only one I have by him is How to Write Science Fiction and Fantasy, which didn't ruin me the way most people say it might, but didn't help me a whole lot either.

I don't think a character does need to remain stagnant to give emphasis to the plot, because then that excuse could be used for any book. "You're supposed to focus on the court intrigue! Stop worrying about whether the character is a worthy prince!" And so on. A detective who grows and changes will make the series a better series.

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[info]onyxflame
2006-02-22 05:29 am UTC (link)
The thing that irks me the most about Card is when he goes on about the price of magic, and proceeds to decide that gruesome stuff like chopping off limbs or siphoning blood is needed to cast spells. Ok maybe, in some worlds. But I'd think the gruesomeness would get old pretty fast, at least if magic was common enough that most people would lose a limb or a family member every other week. Why would they even care anymore?

I think a particularly interesting price of magic would be memories. Maybe then all the Angsty Teen Wizards would forget about whoever died that they've been angsting about for the last 10 years.

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[info]nobodys_grrl
2004-04-02 12:53 pm UTC (link)
Good point with #2, and further, think about how much the character will actually change in their teenage years. I've kept a diary since my first year of high school and reading it over shows just how many times my character has changed. Mood swings, self esteem and -yes- angst make writing a character of this age very hard, I think.

Also if a character is growing up say from a ten-year-old to a seventeen-year-old, their character is likely to change in very large and obvious ways, not the subtle developments of an older character. This could mean having a character starting out as shy and awkward and becoming loud and arrogant, finding their individuality of establishing themselves as part of a herd, finding self-esteem or losing it. I think this could be very interesting to write, but also very difficult. But it is annoying when characters are supposed to be growing up within this kind of age and barely changing at all.

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[info]onyxflame
2006-02-22 05:35 am UTC (link)
Oh good grief. I had much fun (and embarrassment) from going back and reading what I wrote in my diary in high school. "I think about him all the time, but until he starts thinking about me all the time, we're not getting anywhere." I actually WROTE that. Good grief.

Also, I think a lot of authors start with kids that are a lot more mature than they have any right to be to begin with. Why does your 15 year old hero even bother to complete The Quest instead of sucking out the tonsils of the nearest tavern wench? If there's a 7-year-old spouting prophecy, he ought to also be falling out of trees and playing with whatever the medieval equivalent of toy trucks is. But of course most of them are "old souls" or "perceptive for their age" or whatnot. Blergh.

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[info]margaretdumont
2006-02-22 07:14 pm UTC (link)
LOLOL that sounds far too much like my diary.
Ahem- old diary of course :-/

it would be far too much fun to write a story about some 15 year old hero with a prophecy they're too preoccupied to ever fulfil.

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(Anonymous)
2004-04-02 02:55 pm UTC (link)
First, I wanted to say for some time that I really enjoy your essays and rants. I'm saying it now ;-). They are fun to read, make me look at the well-known from a different perspective and occasionally hatch plot bunnies. Although I sometimes wonder where you find the stuff you're ranting about.

I find it because I read loads of internet fan fiction -- to the effect that my cliche detector is in overdrive and I usually run, don't walk, from printed books that invoke character, plot or style of a kind that I have already sent to /dev/null by the megabyte. Saves metres of shelf space.


Anyway, a few thoughts on characters and change.

Some time ago I read an essay on dynamic vs. static characters at (IIRC) swfa.org. The essay described how you need both, to show their development (or lack thereof) relative to each other. I found that both a helpful insight and a useful tool, since it's often easier to measure distance than progress. When you have a (dynamic) hero returning to their (static) home, there should be shock/wonder/amazement/estrangement all around. If there isn't, or if it feels forced, the character hasn't really changed.

I write mostly immortal characters in settings dominated by mortals. It had seemed like a good idea when I was 14, and I never veered far from it -- I never claimed to be one of the great creative minds of our time *g*. So my main characters generally change slower -- and differently -- than the people around them.

This creates a strange minuet: In a short-term-frame, it's secondary characters who have to do all the changing, to create a feeling of passing time and advancing the story, while the main characters are the landmarks in relation to which development can be measured. Long-term, however, "people" do not change at all. The immortals, however, do. Maybe that's because I haven't yet tired of the setup, neither in my own writing, nor in others'.

In the same way, you could have your hard-boiled detective change over a series: Use the the genre's tolerance for formulaic scenarios to confront your detective twice with basically the same situation and chance his or her reaction to it, creating a variant of the static/dynamic duality. (Now I have to dig through the bookshelves in search of an example...)

Re: Mortality, and letting go: I've written death scenes for all my main characters when I was in the depths of teenage angst and needed to kill something. Since then I found that knowing where, how, and most important what for a character will die is a great help in developing her (or him). Even if it's never actually shown it "on screen".

That need not apply only to characters. I generally found that series that started out with an ending in mind (like Neil Gaiman's Sandman, or Babylon 5) do far better in matters of pacing and character development than open-ended series. The best moment to decide when to "let go" is in the beginning -- before you've fallen in love with the characters.


inge

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:46 am UTC (link)
*grin* I read a lot of fanfiction, too- but also a lot of original fantasy on Fictionpress.com, and a lot of that shares the same problems. They try to have cinematic, omniscient beginnings, and it doesn't work. They try to have "special, chosen" characters who do nothing to earn their power but whine and be given abusive parents by the author, and it doesn't work. They try to have magical powers without ever realizing any cost or consequence, and it doesn't work.

There's a lot of lessons to be learned there.

My own long-lived characters see things the other way around (since I mostly write from their viewpoint). Humans flicker past too briefly to make any real change, either in the world or in their lives. They are the ones who make the world shake, and so what if it takes a thousand years to, say, end slavery or end the tension between a particular pair of cities? They have the time.

I think that having an idea of your own characters' deaths, especially if you plan them to happen in-book, is absolutely essential. You have to know how far you're willing to go. I would prefer an author who says, "You know what? I'm not willing to kill any of my characters, but I will make them suffer," to an author who sets up an ending dependent on a character death that he or she then can't go through with.

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[info]avrelia
2004-04-02 04:27 pm UTC (link)
Great that you addressed these problems, and I agree with every part of your rant. I’d love to elaborate though this moment – changes in an immortal character. The concept of immortal (or even very long living characters) and its possibilities fascinate me immensely. Too often though the only difference an immortal character has is that she lived long enough to see many events and to meet famous people. Immortality should give unusual qualities to the character, and yes, she should change as any other character, but in a slightly different manner. What I mean: fighting in a war will change a heroine, who is 20 and who led a comfortable sheltered life before it, to a rather considerable degree. A heroine who lived three hundred years, fought in fifty wars, and is in no danger to die, will take it differently. Will immortality make a hero reckless, eternally bored, unwilling to connect to anybody (they will all die soon, anyway), unable to care?

The characters who don’t change feel quite boring to me, but not only that – character’s changes advance the plot in a natural, not convoluted way, so with boring characters plot suffers, too.

Another problem with the changes is that writers may arise when a heroine does something unheroic. For me, it makes her more real and believable, but many lose all sympathy to her. Buffy is actually the prime example of it. The heroic character faces the dilemma: if she is good all the time, she is two-dimensional, if she falls, audience doesn’t forgive her.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:49 am UTC (link)
I think immortal, or long-lived, characters can change in different ways. For example, suppose one of them becomes devoted to revenge on a particular family (there's a true family curse!) What happens when she achieves her goal and the last member of the bloodline that once hurt her is dead? That has to change her, the same way ending any major goal with a human would, but even more profoundsly, since it was only the length of her life that allowed her to accomplish it at all.

I gave my own near-immortal characters almost no cultural fear of death (what happens in their afterlife is entirely their own choice) and emotions ten times stronger than a human's. That means they can change in sudden explosions, then remain the same way for a few centuries, then do something that rocks the whole world. The pattern of history is different from that of Earth, but, I hope, just as fascinating.

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[info]kadaria
2004-04-02 08:55 pm UTC (link)
>I've lost all respect for authors like Jordan and Goodkind and R. A. Salvatore, Laurell K. Hamilton and Mercedes Lackey.<

Ironically, I did learn something from Lackey. Never ever overkill on details. I remember not finishing at least three of her books because she had gone off on some tangent about a character's life story and 100 pages later when we finally returned the plot I had no idea what was going on.
Can we add 'don't have a huge biography'? I personally think it's more interesting when some aspects of a character's life remain mysterious.

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[info]limyaael
2004-04-03 06:50 am UTC (link)
I learned not to overkill on details from Jordan. He does it with dresses and fountains and jewels and AARGH.

Done right, the biography aspect can be fascinating. Guy Gavriel Kay can circle away from a daring dawn escape to tell about a character's childhood, and I ride happily along. But even that irritates me sometimes, and I really don't like the books that follow every aspect of a character's life from childhood on. They're rarely done with any skill.

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[info]onyxflame
2006-02-22 05:46 am UTC (link)
Heh, I probably UNDERkill on details, simply because I'm afraid I'll put so much in that it gets boring.

Once upon a time, after reading Jane Eyre or some other book written around then, I decided to try my hand at re-re-re-rewriting the beginning of a story I wrote a long time ago and lost.

I went on for a page about the exact quality of late afternoon sunlight hitting fallen leaves on the road my Teenage Hero was walking down.

Eurgh!

The moral of the story: never, ever, EVER attempt to write something that ought to be brief after reading something written in the 19th century.

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[info]kurtoons
2006-07-19 03:25 am UTC (link)
Dorothy L. Sayers began to grow tired of her detective character Lord Peter Wimsey, so she wrote a book intending to marry him off. So she created a female character who would be worthy of him, (and a rather author-insertion-ish character at that), that he could save from the gallows.

But when it came right down to it, she realized that the character she created for Lord Peter to marry wouldn't just leap into his arms. So she wound up stretching the series for several more books as she maneuverd the two of them into a situation where they could give themselves to each other.

Lord Peter did change over the course of the novels. Late in the series one fan complained to Sayers that Lord Peter no longer had the "elfin charm" that he had in the early books. Sayers replied that any man of forty-five who still posessed "elfin charm" ought to be sent to the lethal chambers.

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[info]demiincarnate
2006-12-04 11:18 pm UTC (link)
Hey, how about change on a larger time-scale - say, a transition from ancient times to modern-day? I have a friend who writes sci-fi, and her writing is all well and good... except for the fact that her world is, in essence, the present with spaceships. The same brands, the same literature, etc. It drives me nuts. I'd like to see a rant by you on it.

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[info]aimsme
2007-09-12 07:34 am UTC (link)
Have you ever read the Redwall series? Standing alone, they're great, but the plot and characters remain pretty much the same, despite the changes in name and species, and the passage of time. It doesn't half get annoying.

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